• you need to say how would it be supposed to work


    I would like to have puppet humans, so I do not have to kill them every single time:

    1. I would have maps with them while they will have row with me

    2. I will see all their diplomacy panel but without possibility to do anything

    3. I will move as on my territory

    4. no VAT on exchange of goods

    5. I can control all their fleet and airpower whenever I decide too with a switch -control button on an army - stopping them from regaining control till I decide so or until they rebel / then they lose half of units to me. Armies have Gold Color

    6. I would like to control up 25 % of their standing army with same switch as in case of fleet and airpower

    7. I would like to be able to build in their country structures and my troops (mechs)

    8. I would like to decide where an how to move their spies if needed with a switch-control button

    9. New description in a diplomacy window: Vasal state - link leading to a senior country.

  • There is no need into implementing player vassals... If you want that all make them take printscreens etc. This game is a strategy game with as goal total domination.

    4. no VAT on exchange of goods

    There is also no VAT in this game regardless...

    Lets remain realistic on the goals Golden Frieeza ...

    ANyway the original idea AI puppets. I don't truly see a lot of added value in them the maps are balanced with each nation having the same strength how would you decide who gets vassals and who doesn't when early game it can throw away the balance?

  • Ok,but I would still like it so that you can get AI nations to fight each other. It would be interesting to see AI nations fight each other. Do they do this with Elite AI option enabled?

    IN Elite AI mode they can declare war but you have little influence on against whom they'll do it. There are also tricks to force a war between 2 AI's

  • There is no need into implementing player vassals... If you want that all make them take printscreens etc. This game is a strategy game with as goal total domination.


    In terms of diplomacy and market supremacy is very poorly designed comparing to other titles on the market.

    So let me explain a little bit what I meant.


    1. if you are player loosing you have to choices - die fighting till the end or escape somewhere far hoping you will survive. Most of wars are decide in a border skirmish where one army is shoot with S&S to death. Countries mostly are not affected by wars. Giving option of being vassal allows you to stay in he game with undamaged country in the place you choose to play. Also spares a lot of time winning player as he does not need to pursuit his opponent for the next days .


    2. Becoming vassal could save a lot of countries squeezed between two bigger countries. And in my opinion it would be much safer than being in a coalition full of backstabbers and vultures. If you are peaceful guy wanting to pay for protection and don't mind senior controlling your diplomacy and military- you would be delighted to be a vassal and win map as a 2-3 place.


    3. When I compare our coalitions (without coalitions fleets, armies, treasury or airforce lead by a coalition leader) to coalition in another grand strategy game set in a stars I cannot omit the fact that it would be good to base our mechanics on something what is enjoyable and is selling good . You probably know which star game I am talking about.


    4. Balance in the game is myth after a first week. At start everyone has similar chances. But wolfpacks, friendpacks, multis, bacstabbers, traitors, players using rush strategies, exploits or paid options- they quickly gain upper hand having 3-5 times more provinces than regular players that are always treated like cannon fodders, farms for bigger players.

    Giving control of a country without being conquered is a chance for weaker players to survive and enjoy a game. This way they would be abele to see map progressing, see wars , see different strategies and tactics. They will have chance to enjoy game and learn ho to play it. If they die in 1-4 weeks they will never learn how to play a game.

  • if you are player loosing you have to choices

    Game is about total domination + the fact that usually people quit the second they see a slight loss curve. With that in mind such feature would have limited use and as such I dont think it should be invested it.

    4. Balance in the game is myth after a first week. At start everyone has similar chances.

    True but if you have preexisting vassals it messes up the first second balance.

    Coalitions in supremacy are merely an ingame alliance nothing more is needed her in my opinion. You are probably talking about a game that is not designed to be total domination (in essence some mods probably allow it) but more in a realistic way. Supremacy targets a different market which is seen in many design decisions.

  • WEll actually,I would at least like a way to get AI nations to get to declare war on other AI nations;it would be enjoyable seeing them both destroy each other.


    Also,theoretically,getting vassals or puppets should be impossible before day 8,and even then,you have to have enough score to convince the small nation to become a puppet. That way,it would not mess up the first balance.


    Because by day 8,you probably will see large enough nations,maybe two of them. Also,it could be a way for the weaker nations (both AI and player) to survive without getting steamrolled by the larger nations.


    I combined your 3 posts, NarmerTheLion

  • Also,theoretically,getting vassals or puppets should be impossible before day 8,and even then,you have to have enough score to convince the small nation to become a puppet. That way,it would not mess up the first balance.

    Interesting so it's a bit like the SoI feature in many paradox games you can focus on nations and get them to align with you while you compete with your big neighbours?

  • nteresting so it's a bit like the SoI feature in many paradox games you can focus on nations and get them to align with you while you compete with your big neighbours?

    exactly that


    so you can win by purely military domination or diplomatic domination with more countries under your control .


    maybe target of this game are only people who sit all day long in a game to gain victory but I met a lot of people who would enjoy just being in a game with their small country and do some repetitive task managing their micro-nation. Now they all have to die as there have no chances of surviving.


    My model of Vassals is only for human players. Allows you to force another nation to change into vassal or diplomatically allow smaller countries to look for protection. For giving away some of their freedom they have chance to witness end of map and thus learn a patter4ns that rule every single map.


    it is about giving diplomatic depth to Supremacy. and giving a chance to casual players to enjoy game too. I would prefer to have vassals in America while I have empire in Africa.... plus there are people who like simcity and I have nothing against it as long as they produce units for me.

  • In my view,it should be extremely hard to get vassals. To make someone a puppet,you must require the following:


    - Must be day 8 or higher

    - Must have a sufficiently high score

    - Must have gave Right of Way or Share map (Share map makes it even more likely for them to align with you)


    Now here are some things which will make puppeting easier:


    - Offering Share Map

    - Have lots of troops near their country,to scare them



    (Of course,this is only for AI nations. For players,there should be a different way of puppeting).

  • well they did it to Greece , Poland, Ukraine, Finland, Romania was also treated like a puppet state. Not saying about india, australia, canada and other colonies


    if they create mechanic for Vassals we can use it to create historical RPs in 100 and 500

    Histroically Britain owned 1/4th of the world (and population) and would almost be impossible to balance out for the others, Germany had better equipment + the trench warfare ment offensive side got heavy casualities for little gains. Stalemate war pretty much.

  • I do not think players should actually start out with vassals. All countries,assuming they all have equal score,equal numbers of troops near the would-be-vassal,equal everything,would have equal chance to puppet a country.


    I think Puppets,if ever implemented,should give tribute,in Silver coins,every day. Perhaps 25% of their daily coin earnings? That way,people would compete not only to conquer provinces,but also to gain the most influence among minor nations. In real life,Major nations,such as France,Britain,Netherlands,etc, competed for power and prestige by puppeting (or more precisely,colonizing) other nations in Asia and Africa. So,if implemented correctly,this would make major powers in the larger maps compete for influence,in other continents,with the possibility of Proxy Wars. Also,Puppeting should give some score points to the nations that puppet,to give incentive to actually use the feature.

  • we need diplomatic option - Vassals

    it is not about starting a game with vassals


    if I can create 6 vassals they are sure to win a map with me if I succeed as a coalition.

    But because I do not conquer them I want to have influence over their territories armies production and gains some production from them. + 100% march speed.

    They can play whatever they want as long as they give me what I need to when I need it

  • Yeah.

    With Vassals and Puppets,I think we should also gain the capability to wage a proxy war. It would add more depth to the game,I think. Also,you would not have to deal with as much corruption in provinces,as it only increases when you have more provinces.

    Instead of conquering provinces,you can become a colonial sort of power,having massive influence with your puppets,and getting what you need from them.

  • that is it.


    If I have Australia and a guy in Argentina who hates me , I do not want to keep his provinces. I would like to give them to my Vassal who wishes to colonize S America with my help.

    Or defeat Argentina and create Vassal from him - even if he hates me he still produces money resources army for me so I am ok with that. And if he revolts he will be loosing so much he will be annihilated or turned into vassal once more. With a bit of luck he will turn afk and I will have AI vassal.