How to greatly Increase Defense - Flower Defense

  • as I said, I've tested it. Once you do splits (splitting each time by 1 soldier), for the first - you loose a soldier each time, for the second - your fortress is getting degraded to a previous level after each couple splits.


    But 2-3 weeks ago flower defense was working perfectly.


    Did anyone tried to test it recently?

  • Are you doing this split during combat? If so, I'd say you trigger a new battle - that one unit you splitted off your stack and this one unit instantly gets destroyed by the attacking enemy.


    Nevertheless - the way Budda describes the flower here in this thread never worked that well for me. It ended up in boosting te enemy's morale remarkable because at some tick, the enemy stack was lucky and killed dozends of my single units.

    For me, it works waaaay better if you combine handful of stacks to be in bastion defense.

  • Well, then my sentence after the one that you cited is what I suspect.

    When you do that, do you see that this one unit is immediately showing the red flash (just speaking of the legacy UI) that indicates an active attack?

    not sure about this attack indication, but most of my single-splitted units are getting killed immediately.

  • Whoa whoa whoa. I did it about a week or two back. Had 13 inf with a fort (Don't recall the level) They had higher morale than the ELEVEN 11 men coming to attack them. Set the flower with all 13. which was over an HOUR from them being attacked. First attack, I lost 7 and he lost 6. Second attack, fort destroyed and he took the city with one man left. It's been PATCHED.

  • Whoa whoa whoa. I did it about a week or two back. Had 13 inf with a fort (Don't recall the level) They had higher morale than the ELEVEN 11 men coming to attack them. Set the flower with all 13. which was over an HOUR from them being attacked. First attack, I lost 7 and he lost 6. Second attack, fort destroyed and he took the city with one man left. It's been PATCHED.

    Similar to my experience. I made similar observation about 4 weeks ago.

  • Probably Bytro did something to Break the Flower as it was always considered as an exploit and most players denounce any exploit other than HnR with arty units, I have also noticed that if you have arty sitting inside the fort fire control set for offensive, that the delay march order used for the flower is now causing the arty to NOT fire even when opponents inf units are attacking the fortress walls


    we must again adapt, or revert to 'Gate Keeping' of these exploits as they are discovered and perfected....


    Best thing about this s1914 game is that it is continually evolving.

  • hello


    you do not do defensive flower while engaged in battle or in splash dmg of enemy unit.

    U do it before or

    you leave bastion exactly at the distance of splash from your town which will allow you to get troops to the town and put them in a flower even during attack

    it is probably wort mentioning that we should do 2 steps of bastion - one on the splash dmg and another minute ahead as this will stop enemy in a save distance from our town but second ( closer bastion) will be use as a conductor to suck up dmg to a town


    anyway - if your units are dying to fast after some updates just make it 2, 3 or 5 units in a petal. I am sure devs haven't thought about that


    but I must give them credit - they tried, they really tried :-)


    anyway - offensive flower is much better. But you need HC for that.

    With tertios dividing ranks you stretch game engine mechanic to the limits of its possibilities.

    New articles coming soon as I am testing it now on one of the marshals and is working without to much changes


    Problem is guys that whenever we describe for you any advanced tactic devs try to destroy it... such a hard life

    so I have suggestion - if you see some exploits/strategies you do not understand give us PM shout and our independent Black Sun team will dissect the problem, analyze it, conduct repro and post a new article in the forum about the issue. This way you have 100% guarantee it would be patched sooner than later.


    GL HF

    supp Black Sun



  • A couple of questions.


    1) I've seen a few mentions of using flowers offensively - how does that work?

    2) Is there are counter to the flower defense other than ranged units?


    Thank you.

    PS just to confirm when Buddha says "bastion" he means fort, yes? Or is there some other tactic being referred to?

  • you will see soon enough- but it should be obvious from my descriptions of mechanics behind many strategies how to create offensive flower. anyone understanding mechanics I described in Strategy will see it is far superior to HNR


    there are many counters to a flower defense after the last update - this is why you need to use bastion


    Bastion means forward defense . It can, but does not have, to utilize fort coverage.


    sorry but I will not be writing simpler as you need to understand mechanics behind by strategies. copy-pasting will lead to your slaughter. This is why there are certain levels of understanding game mechanics . You cannot jump from one to another hoping everything will work.

  • Golden Buddha - I have been playing the game for a short time compared to many others it is true. With that being said I am usually considered fairly technical and a fast learner. And while I in no way consider myself an expert, I am certainly not a novice. I am not "copy/pasting". I prefer to understand the mechanics of why and how things work. This is why I ask questions. The things you are talking about are not obvious - at least not to me, nor to many others I have spoken to online. And in my capacity as a mod, I have access to quite a few veteran players.


    So with all that being said, I would welcome any insight you care to shed. But telling me, using different words, I am simply too ignorant is neither helpful nor useful to increasing understanding.


    Thank you however for your initial post on the flower defense. It was very useful.

  • Golden Buddha - I have been playing the game for a short time compared to many others it is true. With that being said I am usually considered fairly technical and a fast learner. And while I in no way consider myself an expert, I am certainly not a novice. I am not "copy/pasting". I prefer to understand the mechanics of why and how things work. This is why I ask questions. The things you are talking about are not obvious - at least not to me, nor to many others I have spoken to online. And in my capacity as a mod, I have access to quite a few veteran players.


    So with all that being said, I would welcome any insight you care to shed. But telling me, using different words, I am simply too ignorant is neither helpful nor useful to increasing understanding.


    Thank you however for your initial post on the flower defense. It was very useful.

    Basically, it boils down to my response to someone when they begin with "Can I ask you a stupid question?"


    I respond, "There's no such thing as a stupid question. If there's something you don't understand and need it clarified, keep asking questions until you DO understand it."

  • I want to thank Hastings TNT for taking time to explain things to me. For those who come after, the offensive flower is not a difficult concept.


    There are a few mechanics/rules you need to understand so you know what you are doing and why.


    1. Attacks happen once per hour
    2. There are a maximum number of units that can fire per unit type. As an example there is no difference in damage from a stack of 40 infantry and a stack of 4000 infantry. They do the same damage every hour because a stack of 40 is their max.
    3. Different unit types have different maximums. Artillery for example max out at 50. Here is a helpful link so that you can see the maximums of the different units:
      https://docs.google.com/spread…L94-ZDG1NdPnCEic/pubhtml#
    4. When 2 stacks of the same unit type arrive to attack the same target, they merge into a single stack. This means if you have 2 stacks of 50 artillery arriving at different times, the second stack does no damage. This is because they are now considered one stack and the maximum artillery that can fire for that hour has already been reached.

      (as an aside - this is the part that was messing me up. I thought if stacks arrived at different times they would still be considered different stacks and would each do damage - apparently not).


    The point of the offensive flower is to keep the stacks separate - so each does damage. This is accomplished by sending the units to different spots past your target. When they run into the target they will automatically fight but because they are going to different destinations, they do not merge - they each remain as a separate stack.


    That's it.


    Except for ranged units. If you send ranged units past your target - they won't fight at range. They will come right up to the target and get caught in a melee battle. Not what you want for ranged units. To get around this in the most efficient way, you need high command so that you can change the fire control to offensive. This instructs a stack to ignore it's movement command and fire at anything that comes into range.


    If you don't have High command, you should be able to send your stacks to different points short of your target. If my understanding is correct, they will still all do damage since they are all separate stacks. I will edit this if someone says this is in error later.