[S1914] Legacy-Removal Feedback Thread

  • recently one of players who never had possibility to play legacy in supremacy tried legacy in COW.

    Judging COW legacy as 10 he estimated that Supremacy revamp is4/10 comparing to COW legacy...


    maybe we can ask some other new supremacy player to t est legacy in COW- tutorial above.

    Let us know how you judge Revamp comparing to Legacy- that would a very indicative opinion as someone who never used legacy in supremacy would be able to see who it worked

    It is cool if players enjoy the current CoW version. The current CoW live version is labeled "legacy client" if you switched to the CoW "beta client" which is still in development, but it is not to be confused with the S1914 legacy mode. The CoW "legacy" mode is still much different to the old S1914 Legacy client. They are not comparable at all imo. The whole map is rendered in modern WebGL graphics also in CoW Legacy whereas in S1914 Legacy it was not, and even though some parts of the UI are in similar places as in S1914 Legacy, they still look very different and were improved many times over the years in CoW while the S1914 Legacy UI was stagnant.


    The gist of it is that all current CoW versions (including CoW Legacy) look much more modern than the old S1914 Legacy version. So if someone says that they prefer the CoW legacy version over the S1914 Revamp we don't see this as indication at all that they would have liked the old S1914 legacy version better.


    While qualitative feedback is important for us to get the right sense in what areas we should improve, it is not so much relevant in the strategic decision if we should offer the old or new S1914 version. We tracked and compared the performance of players (activity, retention, revenue) in both S1914 Legay and S1914 Revamp for months and saw users performing much better in S1914 Revamp. This enabled us to ramp up marketing again for S1914 which was not possible anymore during the late Legacy times (basically we had to buy new players at a loss which was not sustainable, so the game would have died if we hadn't released Revamp). Revamp also allowed us to implement a mobile version which enabled the next step in S1914's growth. So even if some players prefer S1914 Legacy in qualitative feedback it wouldn't matter much if all quantitative KPIs point to Revamp being better (which they did, hence why we made it default).


    The good thing is that we will continue to improve the revamp version. The Revamp UI will be compatible with the new CoW beta client (actually in both games the new clients are called "ultimate client" by us), so UI improvements in either game will also make it to the other game. So we will have every incentive to keep improving it. And also in terms of the map we have further improvements still planned. Just yesterday we released changes that are based on player feedback, like smaller army labels. We still have more feedback on our list that we wanna implement, hope you look forward to it.

  • Corrections made in the latest update are appreciated. The provincial administration is much better than the previous one. The reduced size of the unit label now allows a better view of the map, however, as mentioned in the medium zoom level, the label is seen at a very small size, which makes it difficult to see the number of units; to be able to distinguish well you need to zoom in on the troops. 3D models appear larger than the label and in small countries the 3D unit ends up obstructing the map like the previous label did.


    In my opinion, this is on the right track and the commitment of all designers and also all administrators in filtering our requests is appreciated. I keep commenting that the general problem of the Revamp revolves around the units. The map can be heavy or light, with or without 3D effects, with more brightness, lighting, with stronger or opaque colors, but the main thing that should be highlighted is the units.


    I would like to contribute some ideas regarding this.


    For example, for the high graphics mode, the 3D model could be kept and accompanied by unit numbers that stand out on the map on a transparent label that does not obstruct the terrain.


    Unidades-S1914.jpg


    Unidades-S1914-1.jpg


    Unidades-S1914-2.jpg


    Another case would contemplate the incorporation of a tactical army either in the reduced graphics mode, for those nostalgic for the legacy, or for the game in general; In this way, when the combats are on a large scale with the participation of numerous units, the player will have the option of changing his army to the tactical version. In the legacy there was this option that returned the troops to simple pins.


    This time the tactical army could be similar to the legacy, implementing its unit tag as was done when the Revamp was unveiled.


    Unidades-S1914-3.jpg


    If it is not possible due to programming problems, the design of a label with the graphic elements of the Renovation would be seen as indicated in the following image but clearer.


    Unidades-S1914-4.jpg


    Attentive to any suggestions, I hope that these proposals come true.

  • Thanks. I think most of the remaining map problems would be solved if we introduced map filters with which you could disable either all labels or all 3D models, right? And that when disabling 3D models the pointy end of the labels points directly onto the unit position on the map without any gap. This would be really close to the previous army label layout, just using the modern look. Probably the best compromise for this. We already taskified this on our end so hopefully we come around to doing this soon.

  • I am happy with smaller banner and units icons (Not Tactical armies but better than huge 3d models), also the province admin panel new changes Morale red green arrows and showing province percentage, 2 positive things IMO some suggestions I like to see....


    #1) Return Burning provinces with low morale , the smoke rising from provinces now is same as smoke from factories...


    #2) Anonymous articles in newspaper


    #3) Battle tick only displays when hovering over one unit, can not click on opponents see their battle tick and then hover over your own to see your own battle tick (both Battle Ticks are important), have to toggle back and forth when fighting planes


    Embrace your true nature , enjoy games and have fun!

  • I personally would rather anonymous articles do not return. Too much abuse happens with them.

    I doubt they'll make a comeback. On paper it sounds nice to be able to anonymously spread some information or leak some plans of your enemy that you somehow got intel on but in reality it's often used to simply insult someone without other players being able to report a specific person.

  • Some small details I think would be simple to address:


    • Inactive players do not have a distinct icon on the diplomacy screen, which they did in legacy. It's a very small but useful feature.

    An example of an inactive player and how there is no indication of that status.


    • Lack/inconsistent use of color coding in diplomatic relations.

    Here are the icons used for share map and right of way:


    The drawn portion itself is distinct enough, but their color are exactly the same. Different shades of green/blue would do wonders in helping quickly distinguish them from one another.


    In fact, the war icon already does this, with a very easy to distinguish red:


    Another small nitpick is that your relation doesn't get the colored background. I suppose this is to help distinguish your relation vs their relation, but honestly the white circle border should be more than enough on the rare occasions where you don't have the same mutual relation.

  • I doubt they'll make a comeback. On paper it sounds nice to be able to anonymously spread some information or leak some plans of your enemy that you somehow got intel on but in reality it's often used to simply insult someone without other players being able to report a specific person.

    I'm sorry, but I don't understand why it was not decided to pursue abuse by the authors, instead of depriving everyone of a game tool.

  • We simply didn't like that tool in our game. It promoted toxicity and spam. Even if the posting were not directly against the rules, they were most often still trollposts or lies. Plus the aforementioned regular rulebreaks, which also added too much unnessecary support work. I mean players can still post in the newspaper, but without the anonymous feature they usually behave much better :)

  • there was a way to find anonymous guy by checking posts of enemies- if you declared war on a correct person, then you had it. but since new popularity started to kill everyone with hundreds of bots swarming you- you cannot do it any more.

  • I have to say that the Coke analogy doesn't apply here. The Coca Cola company probably immediately saw in their market data how worse the adoption rates and revenues of the new coke were, and they had to react to them. The situation is exactly the opposite to S1914. S1914's main metrics all improved since we launched the revamp mode and made it the default 2 years ago. Before we launched the revamp mode there were even talks in the company to let S1914 slowly fade out because it was performing worse and worse and didn't meet today's standards anymore. But we decided to give it one more big shot and thus the Revamp was born. The metrics improved after we launched it. If we hadn't done that the game would have died already. Would you have prefered that? I know not everyone is a fan of the new graphics but perhaps it is better than no game at all, right? I can tell you that nowadays with the Revamp S1914 has the best metrics since its inception a decade ago. Most amount of active players, highest revenues. So it was all worth it. And this is not only coming from new users who leave the game after some days, I really have to disagree with the notion that this is our new playerbase. We still have alot of die-hard players and that is backed by metrics, the average account age is actually quite old for our user base. Plus, as I told earlier in this thread, since we deactivated the legacy mode last week we barely see any change in S1914's metrics.

    So yeah, while Coca Cola saw in their data that they made the wrong move and had to react, we are not seeing this in our data - to the contrary. We are making the game ready for the future and our data supports that. We have to constantly improve to stay relevant in today's gaming market. As I said earlier, we also try to incorporate your feedback where we can and you can indeed expect some improvements in the next weeks. I hope you hang in there and continue to provide us with feedback.

    maybe you haven't seen any changes because the old players still had games to play..

    I had four games.. now i only have a 500 (1th with 800 and more provinces) that i will finish and then i will go on break....

    and i will finish it unwillingly because i cannot manage it as i like to do. i use laptop and i don't use the mouse.. why don't you try to manage 500 provinces with touchpad if you have the invisible vertical scroll bar... whoever did this work must be a GENIUS...


    I repeat:

    let everyone try legacy for one week and see what they prefer...


    p.s. most of the new subscribers are multyaccount or people playing a few months...

    (sorry if english isn't correct)


    Danjjj N° 351 of the ranking

  • there was a way to find anonymous guy by checking posts of enemies- if you declared war on a correct person, then you had it. but since new popularity started to kill everyone with hundreds of bots swarming you- you cannot do it any more.

    You do not have to declare war to find 'anonymous author' it is enough to change diplomacy to trade embargo then simply enter search enemies in newspaper and the 'anonymous author' is revealed, however I do agree, that trade embargo could harm your global popularity in using this method to locate the 'anonymous author' .



    We simply didn't like that tool in our game. It promoted toxicity and spam. Even if the posting were not directly against the rules, they were most often still trollposts or lies. Plus the aforementioned regular rulebreaks, which also added too much unnessecary support work. I mean players can still post in the newspaper, but without the anonymous feature they usually behave much better :)

    No way I accept the protecting the community from TOXIC TROLLS rhetoric, this anonymous post is very useful in manipulating arrogant players in maps, and I miss it as it was still available for a long while with legacy although it had been removed from UI ReVamp long ago...I take it that this anonymous posting was eliminated to lower the work load for the volunteer staff, lowering the work load for volunteers was also the obvious goal of changing the 'REPORT PROCESS', volunteers need to be protected ;)


    Embrace your true nature , enjoy games and have fun!


  • You do not have to declare war to find 'anonymous author' it is enough to change diplomacy to trade embargo then simply enter search enemies in newspaper and the 'anonymous author' is revealed, however I do agree, that trade embargo could harm your global popularity in using this method to locate the 'anonymous author' .



    No way I accept the protecting the community from TOXIC TROLLS rhetoric, this anonymous post is very useful in manipulating arrogant players in maps, and I miss it as it was still available for a long while with legacy although it had been removed from UI ReVamp long ago...I take it that this anonymous posting was eliminated to lower the work load for the volunteer staff, lowering the work load for volunteers was also the obvious goal of changing the 'REPORT PROCESS', volunteers need to be protected ;)

    Really? you think that removing anonymous articles and changing the report process lowered the volunteer GO work load? Absolutely NOT. If anything it created more work. You really shouldn't speak on things of which you do not know about.

  • Really? you think that removing anonymous articles and changing the report process lowered the volunteer GO work load? Absolutely NOT. If anything it created more work. You really shouldn't speak on things of which you do not know about.

    Yes, really and I also think Bytro should better cultivate more Bytro Volunteers (GO's) especially for as busy as EN server is, rather than driving away competent GO's, What increased GO work load was Bytro restructuring, GO's quit also adding responsibilities not the removal of Anonymous articles and the reporting process, really sorry you are over worked (under appreciated) and that you do not have more volunteers to help you in your duties.


    Kind Regards


    Embrace your true nature , enjoy games and have fun!


  • i had two games 500 - unplayable in revamp due to lags, server DOS, refreshes, glitches and so on

    i went afk in both trying to ease a pressure on others and they also quit, now when I am back only 1/3 of people stayed on those maps due to huge problems in playing them


    i guess i will wait additional 2-3 months and win without any fight ...

  • Yes, really and I also think Bytro should better cultivate more Bytro Volunteers (GO's) especially for as busy as EN server is, rather than driving away competent GO's, What increased GO work load was Bytro restructuring, GO's quit also adding responsibilities not the removal of Anonymous articles and the reporting process, really sorry you are over worked (under appreciated) and that you do not have more volunteers to help you in your duties.


    Kind Regards

    Great to see you care for the GO's so much and value the time they invest into their communties. Part of the restructuring involved improving direct communication between volunteers and Bytro so that everyone can voice their concearns wants and needs and talk with us on how to improve processes etc.
    I'd like to remind you that we have a lot of data available and are part of everyday business when it comes to handling support tickets. It might be baffling for some regular players but we actually can see and judge the effect our changes have on different aspects of our workload.
    Anonymous articles were removed because they were abused more often than they were used to manipulate the dynamics of a map in an exciting way. Your subjective perception way differ on the matter but taking into account all reports from players we got about it in the past from all languages, it's pretty easy to see the issue with it. If a feature is useful in some situations but has a negative effect on games in many, it gets removed.

    Last reminder that this thread was and still is about legacy feedback. Will remove or move non related posts in the future.

  • What about me? Do I count? Can I reply and post because I have more than a few?
    The quantity of post is not the issue here nor the content, and this is not the place to air grievances in regards to something that you may or may not like.
    This is about Legacy and improvements.
    As was stated by Slyx, please keep it to the issues dealing with Legacy.
    If you wish to start a new thread on the issue, please feel free to do so provided that it remains within the rules and guidelines contained within the ToS.

  • Sorry for a needless post in advance. Just curious as I have been out of the game for a while. When you say the legacy client has been removed, which version are you talking about?

    Legacy Display would have been the display which was in place when you were a Game Moderator in 2018, (which was deleted about a month ago now), clients are still here just adapting to Ultimate Immersion or ReVamp display as it is called here.


    Embrace your true nature , enjoy games and have fun!